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Author Topic: 7% Post Reaction Soap testing  (Read 25616 times)

Offline Jamesrl

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Re: 7% Post Reaction Soap testing
« Reply #15 on: March 29, 2013, 11:20:30 PM »
Around an 85% reduction son.

Soap content of batch 0.79% or 790ml of soap/100ltr
« Last Edit: March 29, 2013, 11:45:51 PM by jamesrl »
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Offline nigelb

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Re: 7% Post Reaction Soap testing
« Reply #16 on: March 29, 2013, 11:57:44 PM »
Wow!

not too far removed from the first attempt.

This needs backing up by others who have the test kits.

Thanks Pops

Nige
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Offline Head Womble

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Re: 7% Post Reaction Soap testing
« Reply #17 on: March 30, 2013, 02:22:02 PM »
I'll test my next batch and post the results, should be next week.
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Offline julesandtash

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Re: 7% Post Reaction Soap testing
« Reply #18 on: April 05, 2013, 06:44:43 PM »
I tried 7% water prewash yesterday on a batch
300 litres of perfect pass biodiesel using two stage process and ASM
At the end of the second stage I left in the glyc from that stage and added 5 litres of glyc back from the first stage (took this from the top of the drum to capture the little bit of bio floating on it.

I then added 20 litres of water, mixed for twenty minutes the let it settle then drained. No emulsion.
After five 20 litre pump water washes and soap testing after each one, my final test was 0.025ml of HCL (or as close as I could estimate, between .45 and 0.50 on a 0.50ml syringe) which, multiplied by 304 gives 7.6ppm soap.
Got to be happy with that.

Nothing other than 120litres of water and a bit of glyc used to get 300 litres of bio with just about no soap. No acid, no acetone and really good results
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7+ years of making bio.
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Offline Head Womble

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Re: 7% Post Reaction Soap testing
« Reply #19 on: April 05, 2013, 07:10:46 PM »
I finished a batch yesterday, much the same as you Julies, no acid wash and no emulsion.

Did you use your eductor when washing ?

I took samples from each stage and will test them and post the results later.

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Offline julesandtash

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Re: 7% Post Reaction Soap testing
« Reply #20 on: April 05, 2013, 07:29:45 PM »
Quote from: Head Womble on April 05, 2013, 07:10:46 PM
I finished a batch yesterday, much the same as you Julies, no acid wash and no emulsion.

Did you use your eductor when washing ?

I took samples from each stage and will test them and post the results later.

No eductor, on the principle that I dont have one on the plant so cant use one  :)
Just an 82lpm pump and 1" steel pipework throughout.
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7+ years of making bio.
1997 RangeRover P38A 2.5DSE and 2001 Audi Allroad 2.5 V6 Tdi all on B100
Home heating and hot water system on Palm based B100 and Aarrow 7KW wood burner on glycerol logs

Offline Head Womble

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Re: 7% Post Reaction Soap testing
« Reply #21 on: April 05, 2013, 07:47:45 PM »
I used my eductor, 110lpm pump, 28mm pipework, 500lpm tank turnover, 200L batch.

If I can do that without an emulsion it sure shows it works.
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Offline julesandtash

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Re: 7% Post Reaction Soap testing
« Reply #22 on: April 05, 2013, 07:51:05 PM »
I really want to pluck up the courage to not put any of the first stage glyc back and just put the water straight in at the end of the second stage with just the glyc from that stage. That would avoid a lot of faffing around.
I wonder if that will still work?

I guess if it goes belly up I could always put a bit of acid in to cure it and they proceed as per acid wash.
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7+ years of making bio.
1997 RangeRover P38A 2.5DSE and 2001 Audi Allroad 2.5 V6 Tdi all on B100
Home heating and hot water system on Palm based B100 and Aarrow 7KW wood burner on glycerol logs

Offline Head Womble

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Re: 7% Post Reaction Soap testing
« Reply #23 on: April 05, 2013, 07:55:19 PM »
Funny you say that, I used 3L of ASM for the first stage so there would be more gly in the second stage,
this way I didn't need to add any gly back in later.
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Offline Jamesrl

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Re: 7% Post Reaction Soap testing
« Reply #24 on: April 05, 2013, 07:58:07 PM »
It appears that Nige's statement about the past is true.

Back to the original GL process then.
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Offline julesandtash

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Re: 7% Post Reaction Soap testing
« Reply #25 on: April 05, 2013, 07:58:47 PM »
Cool. Maybe I will try 4.5litres of ASM in my first stage then and not put any of the first stage glyc back in.

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7+ years of making bio.
1997 RangeRover P38A 2.5DSE and 2001 Audi Allroad 2.5 V6 Tdi all on B100
Home heating and hot water system on Palm based B100 and Aarrow 7KW wood burner on glycerol logs

Offline julesandtash

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Re: 7% Post Reaction Soap testing
« Reply #26 on: April 05, 2013, 08:00:09 PM »
Quote from: Jamesrl on April 05, 2013, 07:58:07 PM
It appears that Nige's statement about the past is true.

Back to the original GL process then.

What was the original GL process then Jim. I though he was an advocate of demething and settling not in processor water washing
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7+ years of making bio.
1997 RangeRover P38A 2.5DSE and 2001 Audi Allroad 2.5 V6 Tdi all on B100
Home heating and hot water system on Palm based B100 and Aarrow 7KW wood burner on glycerol logs

Offline Jamesrl

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Re: 7% Post Reaction Soap testing
« Reply #27 on: April 05, 2013, 08:09:50 PM »
Garham always advocated a 5% post reaction water wash to massively reduce soaps in the final bubble dry and settle.

The post wash was dropped to increase the purity of the reclaimed methanol.
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Offline Julian

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Re: 7% Post Reaction Soap testing
« Reply #28 on: April 05, 2013, 08:33:54 PM »
Quote from: Jamesrl on April 05, 2013, 08:09:50 PM
Garham always advocated a 5% post reaction water wash to massively reduce soaps in the final bubble dry and settle.

The post wash was dropped to increase the purity of the reclaimed methanol.

I never dropped it for that reason ... I used to reclaim the methanol and then do a 5% wash with the remaining glycerine .. best of both worlds.  I only stopped the 5% (or 7% as it later became) wash, because I started using the glycerine for Glogs.

I find acid washing without the glycerine works well for me now, and I still reclaim the methanol and recycle the glycerine.


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Offline Head Womble

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Re: 7% Post Reaction Soap testing
« Reply #29 on: April 05, 2013, 08:56:56 PM »
Well I'm shocked, I've just done the soap tests and this is what I got

Raw bio = 1428.8ppm

7% wash = 206.72ppm

wash 1 = 12.16ppm

wash 2 = 9.12ppm

wash 3 = 9.12ppm (by now it's hard to read such small differences)

wash 4 = 6.08ppm

Each wash used 15L of water (7.5%), pumped for 1hr with eductor running.

This batch was 200L of oil, using 3L of ASM for the first stage, 1.4L for the second stage.
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