Injection pump gummed up

[Head Womble]

I've been having problems with the wife's 406 2.1td not running properly (this has a fully mechanical Bosch from a 405td fitted),
it seemed like a blocked filter so I changed it, this was the start of the problems.

After changing the filter I couldn't bleed the air out, this was tracked down to the fuel return part of the pump being blocked, with what looks like the sticky stuff you see on the side of a deep fat fryer.

So I got a replacement pump off panelbeater (240m round trip) and fitted it, it now runs but it wouldn't rev past 3k,
this turned out to be the filter housing blocked up with gunge, reducing the flow (this was obviously the original problem).

with this all cleaned out the engine ran fine on tick over and revved happily, but when driving it's pulling air in,
this I have tracked down to the pump shaft seal.

I have a new seal but can't fit it for a few days now as I'm back to work tomorrow.

I've brought a new seal kit for the old pump, so when I strip it down I'll take photos of the crap inside, this pump has done almost 90k on bio so it'll be good it see what long term bio use does to them.

I explained that the pump had blocked up to the diesel specialist I got the seals from and he said "that's what happens with bio, it's normal for pumps to go like that".

I'll post photos of the crap in the housing and in the pump it's self, I may even do a wiki page on the long term effects of bio use.
It's worried me as to what my merc pump looks like inside.

[Chug]

Sorry to hear you've been having problems mate, glad you are getting on top of it.
You reminded me though, I have Carl's old lucas pump kicking about somewhere done about 40,000 miles on smartveg TT and I was gonna pull it apart and see what it looked like, hmmm where did I see last?

[Rotary-Motion]

dont forget the pushfit connection on the fuel in line that goes back to the bulkhead in the engine bay on the left side, these suck air, mine has been gone for ages now, i replaced with a pipe and jubilee clip, no air sucking now...

guessing a 2.1 has the same fitting as a 1.9td pug?

[Head Womble]

Yes it's the same fitting, but as I've got no air coming from the filter this bit must be sealing fine.

[Tony]

Hmm. This gumming is perhaps what is happening to my pump and causing the cold start clatter and missing. I'd be very interested in what has happened to mark's pump.

[Head Womble]

I'll give you some more info on the symptoms in the run up to the recent problems,
firstly it started to loose power, only in the top end of the rev range,
then the tick over slowly increased,
this happend over many months.

I did change the fuel pipe from the filter to the pump as this was blocking with hardish deposits,
at the same time I blew the filter housing out with an air line (from the inlet), this increased the power but did nothing for the high tick over.

Now I'm going to say something that some may not agree with,
I think it may be due to demeth and settle as this is the method I predominately used.
It's only a hunch, but but there you go, it's out there now, discuss.

[Rotary-Motion]

90k on bio thats quite something, yes would be interesting to see long term pictures...

i've done about 45k on veg say 99.9% of the time the odd bit of miss fuel in cold winter days... 25k at least on my suasage filter could be more, i gave up counting... still full power range like i just bought it.

same pumps....

[Head Womble]

Basically the same pump yes, but yours has a degree of electronic controle.

I have read a few times that veg/bio has been known to leave a "waxy layer/deposits" inside the pump,
but until now no one on the VOD has seen this, or admitted to it at least.
Me, I say it as I see it, and I'm not worried about upsetting anyone.

I hope it helps others, I also wonder if other now admit to seeing the same.

[Rotary-Motion]

only  fatty deposits i have seen were in the fuel tank on a 405, something to do with the galvanised metal that is/was the fuel sender cover plate, it formed all over that plate for some reason and not anywhere else say on plastic or rubber parts... and the one time i have known it in an injection pump was on a 2.3D nissan vannette, and most of the time it was ran on 50/50 dino/veg mix... it started to block the inlet banjo gauze (which after removal) was never a problem again for many miles... van scrapped in end too much for MOT.

[Head Womble]

I took the old pump apart today

http://www.vegetableoildiesel.co.uk/forum/viewthread.php?tid=36676&page=2#pid416009

[Tony]

Yuk!  Tempted to clean it up and try it out?

[Head Womble]

Yep, I'm cleaning it out, resealing it and putting it back on.
Never done this before so it's a learning curve.

[Tony]

Good man

[Head Womble]

I'd forgotten I could post photo's using the links (until now)
So here you go, one gummed up Bosch VE pump.









The gunk softened up nicely with hot water and washing liquid, but doesn't dissolve in meths, IPA or break cleaner.

It's now fully cleaned up and back together with new seals, awaiting fitting (when I get time, and once I've convinced the wife it needs to be done).

[julianf]

Mark,
 
On a long trip, the return to the tank seems to heat it up a lot.  Do you think some long trips now and again would have melted the junk in the pump, and flushed it through?