Soaps/Acetone

[Head Womble]

... unless I get chance to pop over to Julian for some IPA.

Offer's still there.  I should be in most of the week but possibly out Friday.

I'm not off work until Sunday, I'll see she'll let me out to play.

[Head Womble]

I started my next test today.

I'll add all the info on here so I can reference it when I update the wiki page.

200L batch
Glycerol prewash
Two stage non titration
1st stage 25L methanol and 800g of NaOH
2.5ml dropout in 90/10 test
2nd stage 7L methanol and 240g of NaOH
clear pass 90/10
Glycerol drained
450ml of hydrochloric acid added to 20L of water, pumped for 1hr.
settled for 3hrs, water drained
190L left in reactor
95L (half the batch) drained into clean containers.
50ml sample taken (will test for soap content before washing).
15% water added (without acetone) pump washed for 1hr.

The idea is to do standard pump washes on half the batch and do a soap test after each wash,
once that's done, dried and in the settling/storage tank I'll acetone wash and soap test the other half,
this will give a good compareson test between the two washing methods.

[Tony]

Sounds good Mark.

Nice to see some Biodiesel experimentation going on these days, keeps it interesting

[Head Womble]

Bio has become interesting again with the advent of two stage non titration, titrated acid washing and more recently the developments in the use of acetone.

The fun has returned.

[1958steveflying]

Bio has become interesting again with the advent of two stage non titration, titrated acid washing and more recently the developments in the use of acetone.

The fun has returned.

Nice one Mark,  I have to take a forced period off from playing, had carpal tunnel done on my left hand last week (right was done in Dec) , half the wound is open and infected ! ! ! going to take a while to sort itself Doc say's today. I need to give it a fighting chance so really must refrain till it's mended.  Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

[jgs600]

nice one mark, would love to get my pump washing down to just a couple of washes.

[Head Womble]

Results from this test may have to wait until the next batch s I'm having some problems with the titrated soap tests.

The confusing thing is the 50/50 test done after the acid wash was Crystal clear
The same goes with the first and second washes.
The titrated soap tests are also giving confusing results,
124.64ppm after the acid wash,
54.72ppm after wash 1
94.24 after wash 2.
wash 3 is settling as I type.

I can't believe my bio is this good as making soap is something I'm good at.

[Head Womble]

Bio has become interesting again with the advent of two stage non titration, titrated acid washing and more recently the developments in the use of acetone.

The fun has returned.

Nice one Mark,  I have to take a forced period off from playing, had carpal tunnel done on my left hand last week (right was done in Dec) , half the wound is open and infected ! ! ! going to take a while to sort itself Doc say's today. I need to give it a fighting chance so really must refrain till it's mended.  Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr

Sounds painfull mate, but stay away from the bio until it's healed up properly, I know it's going to be hard though.

[Tony]

Results from this test may have to wait until the next batch s I'm having some problems with the titrated soap tests.

The confusing thing is the 50/50 test done after the acid wash was Crystal clear
The same goes with the first and second washes.
The titrated soap tests are also giving confusing results,
124.64ppm after the acid wash,
54.72ppm after wash 1
94.24 after wash 2.
wash 3 is settling as I type.

I can't believe my bio is this good as making soap is something I'm good at.

Did you use Acetone at all in washes 1, 2 and 3?

[Head Womble]

Results from this test may have to wait until the next batch s I'm having some problems with the titrated soap tests.

The confusing thing is the 50/50 test done after the acid wash was Crystal clear
The same goes with the first and second washes.
The titrated soap tests are also giving confusing results,
124.64ppm after the acid wash,
54.72ppm after wash 1
94.24 after wash 2.
wash 3 is settling as I type.

I can't believe my bio is this good as making soap is something I'm good at.

Did you use Acetone at all in washes 1, 2 and 3?

No, this is the batch I'm doing a compareson test with,
half the batch is being washed without acetone and the other half with acetone,
the idea was to do titrated soap tests at all stages to prove the advantage of acetone.

But so far is not working.

I have however just done a 50/50 test on the unwashed half and it's cloudy.

Now the other tests were done on bio that had been heated in a frying pan to drive off the water before doing the titrated soap test, this must of had an effect on the soaps, but I can't understand why.

[1958steveflying]

Results from this test may have to wait until the next batch s I'm having some problems with the titrated soap tests.

The confusing thing is the 50/50 test done after the acid wash was Crystal clear
The same goes with the first and second washes.
The titrated soap tests are also giving confusing results,
124.64ppm after the acid wash,
54.72ppm after wash 1
94.24 after wash 2.
wash 3 is settling as I type.

I can't believe my bio is this good as making soap is something I'm good at.

Did you use Acetone at all in washes 1, 2 and 3?

Now the other tests were done on bio that had been heated in a frying pan to drive off the water before doing the titrated soap test, this must of had an effect on the soaps, but I can't understand why.

Drying the first wash will drive of Methanol that will not wash out in 1 wash, a soap test on that would have to be shaken to death to make sure any dropping soap is still suspended equally. And the same for subsequent washes until the Meth is actually all washed out.

[Head Womble]

Results from this test may have to wait until the next batch s I'm having some problems with the titrated soap tests.

The confusing thing is the 50/50 test done after the acid wash was Crystal clear
The same goes with the first and second washes.
The titrated soap tests are also giving confusing results,
124.64ppm after the acid wash,
54.72ppm after wash 1
94.24 after wash 2.
wash 3 is settling as I type.

I can't believe my bio is this good as making soap is something I'm good at.

Did you use Acetone at all in washes 1, 2 and 3?

Now the other tests were done on bio that had been heated in a frying pan to drive off the water before doing the titrated soap test, this must of had an effect on the soaps, but I can't understand why.

Drying the first wash will drive of Methanol that will not wash out in 1 wash, a soap test on that would have to be shaken to death to make sure any dropping soap is still suspended equally. And the same for subsequent washes until the Meth is actually all washed out.

I see what you mean, but it only makes a difference with the 50/50 tests, titrated soap tests should still work.

[nigelb]

Mark....you have a personal message regarding the questions you posed.

[1958steveflying]

Results from this test may have to wait until the next batch s I'm having some problems with the titrated soap tests.

The confusing thing is the 50/50 test done after the acid wash was Crystal clear
The same goes with the first and second washes.
The titrated soap tests are also giving confusing results,
124.64ppm after the acid wash,
54.72ppm after wash 1
94.24 after wash 2.
wash 3 is settling as I type.

I can't believe my bio is this good as making soap is something I'm good at.

Did you use Acetone at all in washes 1, 2 and 3?

Now the other tests were done on bio that had been heated in a frying pan to drive off the water before doing the titrated soap test, this must of had an effect on the soaps, but I can't understand why.

Drying the first wash will drive of Methanol that will not wash out in 1 wash, a soap test on that would have to be shaken to death to make sure any dropping soap is still suspended equally. And the same for subsequent washes until the Meth is actually all washed out.

I see what you mean, but it only makes a difference with the 50/50 tests, titrated soap tests should still work.

But if you take a sample and dry it, then it sits until you take your tiny soap test sample off the top then it wont contain the same level of soap that will be at the bottom.  Does that make sense.

[Head Womble]

Results from this test may have to wait until the next batch s I'm having some problems with the titrated soap tests.

The confusing thing is the 50/50 test done after the acid wash was Crystal clear
The same goes with the first and second washes.
The titrated soap tests are also giving confusing results,
124.64ppm after the acid wash,
54.72ppm after wash 1
94.24 after wash 2.
wash 3 is settling as I type.

I can't believe my bio is this good as making soap is something I'm good at.

Did you use Acetone at all in washes 1, 2 and 3?

Now the other tests were done on bio that had been heated in a frying pan to drive off the water before doing the titrated soap test, this must of had an effect on the soaps, but I can't understand why.

Drying the first wash will drive of Methanol that will not wash out in 1 wash, a soap test on that would have to be shaken to death to make sure any dropping soap is still suspended equally. And the same for subsequent washes until the Meth is actually all washed out.

I see what you mean, but it only makes a difference with the 50/50 tests, titrated soap tests should still work.

But if you take a sample and dry it, then it sits until you take your tiny soap test sample off the top then it wont contain the same level of soap that will be at the bottom.  Does that make sense.

Yes it makes sense, but I dried 50ml, cooled it straight away, poured it into a jar and took 12ml from the top, all this was in less than 1 Minuit so no chance for the soap to drop.