Author Topic: Newspaper clears bio ... not sure I believe this myself!  (Read 16799 times)

Offline Julian

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Newspaper clears bio ... not sure I believe this myself!
« on: May 07, 2013, 08:05:30 PM »
For some reason the last couple of batches have turned out very cloudy, so I've been playing with different, cheap or free filter mediums.  A really good performer is news paper, not a new idea, but it works really well.  The only drawback being it's incredibly slow.

Anyhow, I set up a filter arrangement like this ...





What ended up in the jam jar was crystal clear.  Then I noticed that what was sitting in the funnel was also clear ... strange, because it wouldn't clear that quick under gravity ... could the news paper be having some effect??

So I took two fresh samples, folded a sheet of newspaper concertina fashion, stuck it in one of the jars and left them over night, thus ...




Next morning this was the result ...






I have absolutely no idea why this is happening and have only done a couple of tests.  Could others have a go at replicating this please.

The bio was made using two stage ASM process (which I need to post about, as I also done something a little screwy with that which seems to work) and then acid washed, so the cloudiness may be sodium sulfate.

Be interesting to see if it works for others.

« Last Edit: May 07, 2013, 11:18:17 PM by Julian »
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Offline julianf

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Re: Newspaper clears bio ... not sure I believe this myself!
« Reply #1 on: May 07, 2013, 08:26:25 PM »
What's newspaper made of?

What's ecopure made of?

I suspect newspaper is made of anything they can get their hands on, but at least some of it might still be wood?
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Offline julianf

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Re: Newspaper clears bio ... not sure I believe this myself!
« Reply #2 on: May 07, 2013, 08:27:10 PM »
...wondering how much i would need to sort out my barrel of jelly!
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Offline uberveg

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Re: Newspaper clears bio ... not sure I believe this myself!
« Reply #3 on: May 07, 2013, 09:15:02 PM »
I think the bio wicks up the newspaper, increasing surface area for evaporation. I'm guessing the cloudiness is moisture. Had similar thing filtering through tissue paper on a small scale.

Offline Head Womble

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Re: Newspaper clears bio ... not sure I believe this myself!
« Reply #4 on: May 07, 2013, 09:34:45 PM »
I think the bio wicks up the newspaper, increasing surface area for evaporation. I'm guessing the cloudiness is moisture. Had similar thing filtering through tissue paper on a small scale.

This can be checked by putting some in a jar with the lid on.
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Online nigelb

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Re: Newspaper clears bio ... not sure I believe this myself!
« Reply #5 on: May 07, 2013, 10:11:39 PM »
I'd love to help with this experimentation...but I don't know how to make cloudy bio. ::)

However, I await, with baited breath for details on your ASM methods

Offline Jamesrl

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Re: Newspaper clears bio ... not sure I believe this myself!
« Reply #6 on: May 07, 2013, 10:58:10 PM »
I'd love to help with this experimentation...but I don't know how to make cloudy bio. ::)


I know what you mean Nige, what is this cloudy stuff they speak off.

Offline Julian

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Re: Newspaper clears bio ... not sure I believe this myself!
« Reply #7 on: May 07, 2013, 11:15:55 PM »
I think the bio wicks up the newspaper, increasing surface area for evaporation. I'm guessing the cloudiness is moisture. Had similar thing filtering through tissue paper on a small scale.

Not moisture, the bio was dewatered after acid and pump washing with a condenser at 90°C.
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Offline Julian

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Re: Newspaper clears bio ... not sure I believe this myself!
« Reply #8 on: May 07, 2013, 11:16:37 PM »
I think the bio wicks up the newspaper, increasing surface area for evaporation. I'm guessing the cloudiness is moisture. Had similar thing filtering through tissue paper on a small scale.

This can be checked by putting some in a jar with the lid on.

Yup, I can try that.
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Offline Tony

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Re: Newspaper clears bio ... not sure I believe this myself!
« Reply #9 on: May 07, 2013, 11:16:56 PM »
I've seen bio go cloudy when exposed to atmosphere (as happens with my settling) for too long, especially in winter.  A trip through the drywash tower fixes it.  Interesting stuff Julian!


Offline Julian

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Re: Newspaper clears bio ... not sure I believe this myself!
« Reply #10 on: May 07, 2013, 11:20:32 PM »
What's newspaper made of?

What's ecopure made of?

I suspect newspaper is made of anything they can get their hands on, but at least some of it might still be wood?

Other obvious tests are different papers, card, cadrboard etc.
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Offline Jamesrl

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Re: Newspaper clears bio ... not sure I believe this myself!
« Reply #11 on: May 07, 2013, 11:21:36 PM »
I've seen bio go cloudy when exposed to atmosphere (as happens with my settling) for too long, especially in winter.  A trip through the drywash tower fixes it.  Interesting stuff Julian!

So what a bout a vessel filled with cross chopped shredded newspaper, a sort of dry-wash tower thing.

Offline Julian

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Re: Newspaper clears bio ... not sure I believe this myself!
« Reply #12 on: May 07, 2013, 11:24:13 PM »
A suggestion from a mate down the pub tonight (I know, youshould never believe a man in the pub ... but this one has a PhD in chemistry), was that it may be entrained air.  But I have thought that air would dissipate quite quickly.
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Offline Julian

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Re: Newspaper clears bio ... not sure I believe this myself!
« Reply #13 on: May 07, 2013, 11:26:41 PM »
I've seen bio go cloudy when exposed to atmosphere (as happens with my settling) for too long, especially in winter.  A trip through the drywash tower fixes it.  Interesting stuff Julian!

So what a bout a vessel filled with cross chopped shredded newspaper, a sort of dry-wash tower thing.

If there's merit in what I'm seeing (and I've still got my doubts) then the easiest production method is to hang sheets of paper in the settling barrel ... no new equipment.
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Offline knighty

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Re: Newspaper clears bio ... not sure I believe this myself!
« Reply #14 on: May 07, 2013, 11:34:36 PM »
if the bio is clear fresh (hot) out of the reactor

and then it clouds up

whatever fats the cloudyness is made from must be floating around in the bio, and then group up and join together to form tiny fat lumps which we see at cloudyness

maybe it's easier (less energy) to form fats on the surface of the newspaper than it is for then to stick to each other ?

and/or it's easier to bump into and stick to the massive surface area of the newspaper than another tiny fat molecule ?


you could test a thin slither of newspaper and see what happens, does it totally clear the bio, and is there a residue left on it ?

could also try cardboard, a plastic bag, a bit of wood, broken glass, some kind of cloth/wool/denim etc... if you've got a dog, comb it then stick some of it's hair in there ?

(just trying to cover all biases with materials/surfaces)

if you can narrow down exactly what's going on, it would be much easier to adapt it into your process / make it more efficient


if it is the rough surface helping the fats form like I'm guessing, then newspaper probably will be one of the best things for it because it has a rough surface...

if that's right, then it would be pretty easy to roll up some newspapers into some drain pipe and pump the (cold) bio through... not sure how fast you could pump it... I can't decide if using lots of newspaper tightly packed in will mean you can pump it through pretty fast or not... still thinking on that one   ;)