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General => Chatter => Topic started by: K.H on January 03, 2014, 09:15:32 PM

Title: FAO Knighty
Post by: K.H on January 03, 2014, 09:15:32 PM
 Err, hate to mention it, but any news on that control box thingy? ;D
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: knighty on January 04, 2014, 03:28:18 AM
erm... i thought i posted it ages ago ?

let me check.... i probably forgot (sorry)

I'll post back tomorrow !

(i finished it aggggges ago...)
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: BANDIT2 on January 04, 2014, 04:02:28 PM
Hope it wasn't posted via Myhermes- you'll never see it again
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: Dickjotec on January 04, 2014, 09:12:32 PM
Hope it wasn't posted via Myhermes- you'll never see it again

Thought you had emigrated, bandit, you OK?
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: K.H on February 07, 2014, 04:54:11 PM
Bump
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: Jamesrl on February 07, 2014, 06:48:16 PM
I haven't read this tread honest cos it's for you Knighty not me.
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: K.H on March 18, 2014, 08:06:10 PM
BUMP
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: Tony on March 18, 2014, 08:23:46 PM
More like bounce :)
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: kamaangir on March 18, 2014, 08:40:52 PM
He said he fell off a ladder and broke his wrist, more than likely he was up a ladder trying to grope some one thorugh a window and they slammed it on his wrist and he also fell off the ladder!  :o
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: nigelb on March 18, 2014, 08:45:46 PM
BUMP

You know it ain't gonna happen Keith. ::)
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: K.H on March 18, 2014, 09:21:27 PM
No harm in trying Nige

BTW is this worth putting in an offer on?
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/261419697387?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: Julian on March 18, 2014, 10:52:32 PM
No harm in trying Nige

BTW is this worth putting in an offer on?
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/261419697387?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

Not if next winter is anything like this one.
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: K.H on March 19, 2014, 07:35:48 AM
Would just settle for getting my bits back, it's a hard one when someone is doing it Foc
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: nigelb on March 19, 2014, 08:12:47 PM
No harm in trying Nige

BTW is this worth putting in an offer on?
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/261419697387?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

It could be worth a cheeky offer but only on a known quantity. £206 for 3/4 full is a bit dodge. If it could be quantified in weight or in litres it may be worth it.
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: knighty on March 20, 2014, 09:33:27 PM
out of hospital, things looking up now (was looking at chance of loosing use of wrist and possibly hand too)

I'll get it posted off asap

I'm dyslexic, I get distracted easy and forget like I never knew about it in the first place

injured now, so cant do anything, so no distractions!
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: Rotary-Motion on March 21, 2014, 07:04:26 PM
nudge
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: Tony on March 21, 2014, 09:03:02 PM
out of hospital, things looking up now (was looking at chance of loosing use of wrist and possibly hand too)

Wow that's scary - glad it didn't come to that, what a thing to face.
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: nigelb on March 25, 2014, 03:57:41 PM
No harm in trying Nige

BTW is this worth putting in an offer on?
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/261419697387?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649

I've just had another look at this auction/sale on the bay and the it's only really worth £170 if the tin really is 3/4 full. What he's factored in is the delivery charge he had to pay from the suppliers.
The real price for 25lts of synergy is £189.95 + VAT
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: K.H on March 25, 2014, 05:39:34 PM
He would have to drop considerably to be worth it
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: nigelb on March 25, 2014, 07:30:05 PM
He would have to drop considerably to be worth it

Yep..that's the way I see it.

It's all very well paying for delivery...but someones elses...nah!
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: kamaangir on March 25, 2014, 07:45:37 PM
I wouldn't bother buying it at all. How do you know its all what is supposed to be? Could be topped up with anything. At a fraction of the price its worth a gamble but at close to the price of new chems its not.
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: photoman290 on March 26, 2014, 12:37:20 PM

I'm dyslexic, I get distracted easy and forget like I never knew about it in the first place


you as well. i have a box all packed up ready to go to someone for the last year.
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: K.H on March 26, 2014, 05:31:09 PM

I'm dyslexic, I get distracted easy and forget like I never knew about it in the first place


you as well. i have a box all packed up ready to go to someone for the last year.
Knighty didnt give it you to post did he?  :D
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: photoman290 on March 26, 2014, 06:44:11 PM
consider yourself extremely lucky to get your eberspacher so promptly :P, even if city link did n manage to  lose it for 4 days.
 
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: K.H on May 10, 2014, 01:32:58 PM
Up
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: K.H on July 07, 2014, 08:50:28 PM
Many thanks Mr Knighty, a very pleasant surprise  :)
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: Rotary-Motion on July 07, 2014, 09:21:43 PM
when I see it my first thought was vents top and bottom due to HE in there over heating.

if a lower voltage is in there you maybe able use a pc fan, think I got a couple somewhere with guard covers in chrome, (not sure what the black box gives out in volts or ac/dc?) and thinking of it will that bit stay live all the time? ie not switched on auto
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: knighty on July 08, 2014, 04:56:28 PM
iirc the 12v DC transformer is live all the time... but it was a long time ago so don't quote me on that...


edit:
it will be live when you're processing otherwise the float switch wouldn't work


also, do you want me to do a diagram of where to wire your mains in ? - I took a photo before I went to the BBB so I could lable stuff for you :-)
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: K.H on July 08, 2014, 07:06:07 PM
do you want me to do a diagram of where to wire your mains in ? - I took a photo before I went to the BBB so I could lable stuff for you :-)

Yes please
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: K.H on August 27, 2014, 08:54:03 PM



also, do you want me to do a diagram of where to wire your mains in ? - I took a photo before I went to the BBB so I could lable stuff for you :-)

Got the box mounted now and a power supply installed by the leccy, so a diagram would be great if you could  :)
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: knighty on August 28, 2014, 08:28:19 AM
oops, sorry forgot all about it !

I'll sort out a diagram later on when I have a min

when it's mounted on the wall, normal mains power (positive) goes into the top contactor

E7 power (positive) goes into the contactor underneath is

negative and earth go into the rail mounted connector block thingies at the bottom - iirc, the earth one was a bit full, so you could earth to the box with rig terminals where there's already an earth connected there :-)


all the heater/pump etc.. wires are labeled up, so you should be ok with those ones


remember to use decent thick wire for the mains in if you want to run 2 (or 3) heaters at once!
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: K.H on August 28, 2014, 09:26:57 PM
Ta muchly  :)
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: K.H on September 06, 2014, 09:06:04 PM
Any luck?, the electrician put the E7 and mains to it today and dropped the front panel, which has pulled a wire out and im buggered if i can work out where it goes
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: knighty on September 06, 2014, 11:16:18 PM
I had a hunt for a photo but this is the only one I could find

(http://i.imgur.com/J2bnFoi.jpg)


I'm sure I had a better quality one than that somewhere but can't find it anywhere  :-(


can you take a couple of better photos and I'll label them up ?
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: K.H on September 06, 2014, 11:54:53 PM
Will do :)
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: K.H on September 07, 2014, 07:37:50 PM
This is the black wire i released from captivity, at the mo its poked in where i thought it may of come from

(http://i316.photobucket.com/albums/mm323/KRH01/control%20panel/controlpanel00_zps2f4cecd0.jpg)
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: Julian on September 07, 2014, 07:48:41 PM
Far be it from me and all that, but would it be helpful if you identified which end you "poked in"?
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: K.H on September 07, 2014, 07:55:01 PM
Err, top one i think, it wasnt actually me, the leccy dropped the front that pulled it out and told me he had put it back under the only slightly loose screw he could find, but helpfully informed me that he couldnt swear it came from there
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: knighty on September 08, 2014, 02:55:29 AM
erm... I have no idea

can you get a top down photo ?

it looks like it's coming out of the timer and then going into the input of a contractor... which is wrong

but... it's hard to tell from the photo.... it could be that it's coming out of the timer and powering the contractor on....


I'll be able to tell from a top down photo
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: K.H on September 08, 2014, 09:10:17 PM
These are all the pics i have at the mo, can take more if needed  :)
BTW the pressure/float switch what will it cut out if activated?

(http://i316.photobucket.com/albums/mm323/KRH01/control%20panel/003_zps5e24b76f.jpg)

(http://i316.photobucket.com/albums/mm323/KRH01/control%20panel/002_zpsb77ddab2.jpg)

(http://i316.photobucket.com/albums/mm323/KRH01/control%20panel/controlpanel00_zps2f4cecd0.jpg)

(http://i316.photobucket.com/albums/mm323/KRH01/control%20panel/controlpanel012_zps14c85364.jpg)

(http://i316.photobucket.com/albums/mm323/KRH01/control%20panel/controlpanel005_zpse99c2122.jpg)

(http://i316.photobucket.com/albums/mm323/KRH01/control%20panel/controlpanel007_zps66126f76.jpg)

(http://i316.photobucket.com/albums/mm323/KRH01/control%20panel/controlpanel010_zps3f244e18.jpg)

(http://i316.photobucket.com/albums/mm323/KRH01/control%20panel/controlpanel002_zps09fb3f44.jpg)

(http://i316.photobucket.com/albums/mm323/KRH01/control%20panel/controlpanel009_zps0aecbe07.jpg)
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: Julian on September 08, 2014, 09:23:30 PM
Oh, this is getting tedious.

Just connect it to earth and switch on ... what could possibly go wrong?
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: Tony on September 08, 2014, 09:37:29 PM
You might let the magic smoke out :)
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: K.H on September 08, 2014, 10:28:09 PM
Oh, this is getting tedious.

Just connect it to earth and switch on ... what could possibly go wrong?
When can you nip over and hold the metal box, i promise to disconnect you with a large piece of 4x2, it would be my pleasure  ;D
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: knighty on September 08, 2014, 11:50:36 PM
if you can get a top down photo of the green timer relay, I'll be able to tell where it's connected in, and what it's supposed to do :-)

I think/guess right now, that it's probably the negative feed for the timer, and the electrician has knocked it out when he's been wiring in the main negative feed ? (no biggie, it's easy done)

the float cuts out the negative feed to the heater contactors for the processor, so cuts off the processor heaters


EDIT: WAIT !

don't turn it on

unless he's re-wired them to suit... he's wired the main feeds into the wrong side of the contractors !
(I'm only suggesting he might have re-wired them to suit because it's such a school boy error!)

also... can you do a photo of the whole box... it;s hard to tell how he's wired in the negative, there it looks like he's joined them both together with a connector block, and then used another connector block to join a spur to the pumps and then maybe run a small wire to the negative terminal block... if he has... that's no good at all.... you'll have a min,. of 26 amps running through the negative when you're running 2 heaters at once....

where do you live again ?

I could see if I'm coming anywhere close sometime ?

I tried to lay everything out as cleanly as I could, but it was a bit tight fitting it all in the box, and the PIDs sticking back into the box meant I had to squash everything around the sides a bit


main feeds in must be wrong... it's wired up so the transformer for the washing machine switch, and the SSR both have a permanent feed from daytime power, and no power from E7 power

major schoolboy error... was he any good ? I know it was a bit full in the box... but anyone who's every worked on electrics would have been able to see all of the outputs coming out of one side of the contacts, and that the other sides of them were all connected in parallel... it's standard practice for connecting up stuff like that...
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: Tony on September 09, 2014, 12:09:03 AM
This is definitely going to be one of those "death or glory" moments when the power is switched on :)
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: knighty on September 09, 2014, 09:54:15 PM
quick run down of how it's wired up....

you've got your 2 main contactors at the top right, the top one is normal power, the bottom one is night time power

they're controlled by the 2 on/off switches on the front panel
there negative feed comes through the big emergency stop switch on the front

the extra contacts on top of them are there so you can't power both contactors at the same time, for one to powered on, the other must be off

the power coming out of both of those (on there left) is joined together, and then there's 3 wires running to the lower (white) contacotrs - the bottom 3 control your heaters (these are controlled by the switches on the front panels, which get their power from the PIDs)

power also feeds to the switches for your pumps, which are controlled directly by the switches on the front panel

the top white contactor is for the timer, so you can hit the dewater button on E7 power, it'll dewater for X amount of time then shut off

(looking harder at it, it *looks* like the little black wire which came loose is in the right place

the green relay is the timer (the timer settings are ontop of it... iirc it's set for 3 hours, but its just a little screw to turn to change it)

under that is the main negative contactor, you mains incoming negatives should be connected directly into this - because thats where the heater negatives are connected to

(I'm sure there was space here for the 2 main negatives to feed right in... I was pretty cautious about that in case you ever turned all 3 heaters on at once

I powered it all up, and tested everything when I finished it, and then again before I brought it to the BBB and it all worked as it should




BUT.... you need to wire the 2 x positive feeds into the other side of the contactors - it is a bit tight... but I got little short wires in there ok, so the nice long main feed wires should be fine

the negatives defenatly need to be done better... the pumps and everything else are only low power, follow the 3 x heater wires (orange) and see where there negatives go, they need a good solid negative
(negatives are overlooked a lot of the time)
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: K.H on September 09, 2014, 10:21:51 PM
I didnt get chance to do anything today, i think tomorrow i will put it back to how it was then do it myself following your instructions and post pics as i go, i wont be putting it live before its been okayed
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: knighty on September 09, 2014, 11:53:10 PM
there's very very little change of anything going bang... worst case is something won't work properly... and we can easy sort that out from pics :-)
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: K.H on September 12, 2014, 06:25:18 PM
Well ive had a go myself, does this look ok?
i had to use a block connector on one negative to extend it to reach the negative connection block

(http://i316.photobucket.com/albums/mm323/KRH01/control%20panel/013_zpse95cf6a0.jpg)

(http://i316.photobucket.com/albums/mm323/KRH01/control%20panel/012_zpscc63a005.jpg)

(http://i316.photobucket.com/albums/mm323/KRH01/control%20panel/010_zps90ff423c.jpg)

(http://i316.photobucket.com/albums/mm323/KRH01/control%20panel/009_zps47528fe1.jpg)

(http://i316.photobucket.com/albums/mm323/KRH01/control%20panel/007_zps81d11f35.jpg)

(http://i316.photobucket.com/albums/mm323/KRH01/control%20panel/006_zps0d2e84c4.jpg)

(http://i316.photobucket.com/albums/mm323/KRH01/control%20panel/d699bda6-a79d-4658-9bd5-03f256a1c763_zps513c3a61.jpg)

(http://i316.photobucket.com/albums/mm323/KRH01/control%20panel/008_zps4cae1a97.jpg)
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: knighty on September 12, 2014, 09:47:55 PM
looks good to me

pull out that little black wire that came out, tape the end up and power it up... see what doesn't work and then we'll know what that wire was for :-)
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: K.H on September 12, 2014, 09:59:46 PM
Will do  :)
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: K.H on September 13, 2014, 09:45:49 PM
Ive removed and taped the wire, but i suppose i had better connect up the two PID,s and Pressure switch before i turn it on, so i might be a few days  ;D
BTW the two probe wires to each PID does it matter which way round they go?
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: Julian on September 13, 2014, 10:45:03 PM
BTW the two probe wires to each PID does it matter which way round they go?

Yes, if they are thermocouples, you'll have + and - .  You won't do any damage connecting a thermocouple round the wrong way.  If you get a plausible reading they're the right way round.  If the wires have the correct plugs going to a socket, there's only one way it'll fit ... the pins are different sizes.

Coincidence ... I'm playing with a PID right now!
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: K.H on September 13, 2014, 11:08:16 PM
No pins just wires, on one PID they go to 7 and 8, other 11 and 12, no + or - shown, so looks like i will have to do as you say, trial and error

 
BTW the two probe wires to each PID does it matter which way round they go?

Yes, if they are thermocouples, you'll have + and - .  You won't do any damage connecting a thermocouple round the wrong way.  If you get a plausible reading they're the right way round.  If the wires have the correct plugs going to a socket, there's only one way it'll fit ... the pins are different sizes.

Coincidence ... I'm playing with a PID right now!
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: K.H on September 15, 2014, 10:09:38 PM
If i want to bypass the cut out switch for the time being is it just a case of leaving alone?
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: knighty on September 15, 2014, 11:00:15 PM
which cut out switch ? the big main one ?

just ignore it... it only does anything when you push it in :-)
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: GedsJeep on September 15, 2014, 11:32:53 PM
forgive my ignorance....

what does all that lot do?
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: Jamesrl on September 15, 2014, 11:39:50 PM
forgive my ignorance....

what does all that lot do?

It's just to make his toast in the morning.
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: GedsJeep on September 16, 2014, 01:19:55 AM
cant he afford staff?
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: Jamesrl on September 16, 2014, 10:00:27 AM
cant he afford staff?

Yeh, he's got RM but he's useless at toat.
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: GedsJeep on September 16, 2014, 11:54:27 AM
oh.

i see...... :-X
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: K.H on September 16, 2014, 03:28:21 PM
The boy has flown the nest and entered the world of full time employment, we get damn thirsty now!
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: Jamesrl on September 16, 2014, 04:13:01 PM
The boy has flown the nest and entered the world of full time employment, we get damn thirsty now!

How'd he get out of the cage, or were you one of the four arrested yesterday?
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: K.H on September 20, 2014, 07:30:54 AM
Don't suppose you've had any luck finding the wiring diagram?
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: knighty on September 20, 2014, 05:11:17 PM
nope... is it not working right ?
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: K.H on September 20, 2014, 08:26:38 PM
nope... is it not working right ?
I wont be doing any more to it until i find a leccy who knows what hes at  :)
The reason i wanted the wiring diagram was because i had to get rid of the big processor with two immersions so there will be a heater cable free, which would be useful running a pump
Title: Re: FAO Knighty
Post by: knighty on September 21, 2014, 12:38:12 AM
you could cheat... set the thermostat for that immersion low so it's always on, then just use the heater switch for a pump switch ?