Biopowered - vegetable oil and biodiesel forum
General => Wiki and forum discussion => Topic started by: Julian on May 29, 2011, 06:04:49 PM
-
Great page, but it not getting indexed on the main page because it has no categories ...
[[Category:Vegetable oil]]
[[Category:Filtration & drying equipment]]
Would do it.
-
Its not finished so i dont want it "live" yet
Its now a dual processor
-
Oh, sorry I didn't know!
I already linked to it from a page I posted ... Do you want the link removed?
-
No thats ok,whats there is fine but with a bit of help from RM, Nige and Vince ive made it so it can also make bio although it will be a very "basic" ;D design and there are a couple of suggestions ive yet to implement.
It started as a filter set up with bypass but then i decided it was not that far from a processor and i thought it would be of use to guys who filter but are left with crud,so say every 500 litres of filtered they could do a batch of bio so they can use 100% of whats collected,good idea or not?
It will need a title change at some point is that possible?
-
Yes completely possible. What new title do you want?
Happy to alter the original processor page you did too, I was just under the impression that you had agreed with the changes at the time! The second tank on that system struck me as a wash tank which would make the basis for a separate page, allowing people to add it to either a 'GL' or a 'proper processor if they wished.
Happy to do a graphic similar to the existing processor graphics for your current page if you wish.
-
Dual processor maybe? or open to suggestions,anyway no hurry until ive amended the page
Graphics would be great,probably need two? one to cover each process?
With the basic page it was just something i noticed when i reread it,
ive just looked again and i suppose the only thing wrong with the pic is the label "240lpm pump"can that be removed?
Do you see how i was reading it? ie
the basic processor includes a 240 lpm pump then it can be upgraded with a bigger pump and eductor,i didnt want people thinking it needs a 240 pump to start with and if they added to it the bio would be ready 5 mins before they put it in :)
Just a thought maybe label it "basic with upgraded pump" that would explain it
-
I think I get where you are coming from. Is this photo better?
http://www.biopowered.co.uk/wiki/File:Modified_KH_processor.jpg
-
Spot on :)
-
Goodo.
If you want to swap the two, just replace the original file name with ...
Modified_KH_processor.jpg
-
Page is nearly done now,ive made a batch of bio to check it out,i will ask RM to add some links and rearrange the bottom pic
Julian
How does "dual processing system" sound?
And could i take up your offer of graphics and email you a really rough sketch of the valve workings?
-
Happy to do graphic. My email address is listed on both forums. If you want a "state diagram", can you include an operation sequence too.
Naming is entirely up to you, but a suggestion would be "Processor - dual function" to keep it in line with existing pages.
I hesitate to suggest anything more basic!
-
E mail sent,your address on here is "hidden" to me :(
Processor/filter station-dual function-is that in keeping?
-
Got the email, but I really can't see it working ... there's no condenser!
-
I keep it in the same place as the eductor-The bin!
Just found a major flaw with mine,pumping out finished bio is a wee bit difficult with a float switch on the pump! :-[
In the plans its connected to the imm but i had fitted one to the pump when it was just going to be a filter set up
-
I keep it in the same place as the eductor-The bin!
Just found a major flaw with mine,pumping out finished bio is a wee bit difficult with a float switch on the pump! :-[
In the plans its connected to the imm but i had fitted one to the pump when it was just going to be a filter set up
hmm yes didnt think on total pump out for bio, a veg only system keeps oil level in crud zone forever after first fill over the heater element so all good there....
-
Bloody armatures.
Let them build processors without condensers and eductors and look what happens!
-
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armature
-
Ooops! That'll be the spell checker and my lack of attention!
I hope my mistake didn't detract from the very serious point I was making!
-
Armature indeed!,its alright for you lot that have got nothing better to do than watch a few pennies drop into a jar for hours
Now to be serious (this will only happen once)
No reason a condenser cant be fitted,just move the breather to the lid?
a venturi should work although the pipework contains tight bends to keep everything close in
BUT if you are just making a crud batch every 300/400 lts of good oil is it worth it? more batches and i imagine you would make dedicated processor?
Eductor,cant see why not
BUT you would be limited to making the same size batch everytime and as this would be crud i personally would 2 stage it,then an eductor is useless
Inline heater,sorry thats a definate no-no,as its primarily a filtering set up the heater needs to be in the tank so that you can heat without circulating
Squirrel? now your just taking the yellow stuff!
-
I detect a theme here?
Have to agree with your reasoning in respect of multi tasking processor though.
-
Juliain,me and RM have added a dispensing part to it now so how about "processor 3 in 1" ?
I will add a relevent piccy at the weekend
Its only for the wvo as the bio would be dispenced from its wash tank/tower
The outlet to car,from the bottom filter will have a tee in it going to the pipe from the top filters to settling tank,inline will be a pressure valve so when you release the trigger the valve will divert the oil back into the settling tank,if you follow :) its cost just under £25 so worth doing i think
-
i class it as wvo and bio now its made and piped for it and thirdly dispensing so yes a 3 in 1 system
so good to go in both bio and veg side links (which i done)
i cant seem to get it on main page???
tried ncl links on page no joy
-
Paul, there's a small quirk with the NCL script ... to get a new page to list automatically you have to go into edit on the main page and click save without changing anything.
Obviously the new page must have categories or NCL won't know how to list it.
-
Hav,nt got a clue what you two are on about but 3 people on line WEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
-
Just noticed you only have major categories on the page .. veg and Bio.
Leave those on the page and try adding ...
[[Category:Processors and equipment]] and [[Category:Filtration & drying equipment]]
Then edit and save the main page.
Is three a record! Let's have a party!
-
Look, you scared RM off and spoiled the moment.
-
He will be back-like a bad smell ;D
-
im fricken here hahahaaaaaaaaa 8)
-
4 now, i feel faint!
-
Just noticed you only have major categories on the page .. veg and Bio.
Leave those on the page and try adding ...
[[Category:Processors and equipment]] and [[Category:Filtration & drying equipment]]
Then edit and save the main page.
Is three a record! Let's have a party!
all done in main page now!
thx chap....
-
5 now 4 + 1 guest
-
ok the main page!
need to change/edit title so it says
Processor - 3 in 1
not what it is now!
-
also just put right bottom pics you had 2x gallerys inside 1x gallery wasnt quite like above layout
all good now!
yehaaaaaaaaaaaaaa
-
Page looks good. I'll try and catch up with the diagrams.
Keith ...
If you let me know the URL, I'll lift the float switch photo without the Reaconverter stamp.
-
check these bad boys out!
http://www.fluidswitch.com/
-
Ive got it in photobucket ok,it was when i had to convert to upload,used up my free trial :(
(http://i316.photobucket.com/albums/mm323/KRH01/140.jpg)
-
Ooo, it's very small. Did you resize it?
-
(http://i316.photobucket.com/albums/mm323/KRH01/KGrHqZl4E3HHtTthfBN7lpEGjB0_12.jpg)
-
pic changed!
;D
-
Do those float switches survive long term gunking up with crusty WVO?
-
It was recommended by Vince who's had no problems so far
-
It was recommended by Vince who's had no problems so far
at the position that is, if it were in my system, that would be very clear/clean oil level section, so all good to go
8)
-
Juliain,me and RM have added a dispensing part to it now so how about "processor 3 in 1" ?
I will add a relevent piccy at the weekend
Its only for the wvo as the bio would be dispenced from its wash tank/tower
The outlet to car,from the bottom filter will have a tee in it going to the pipe from the top filters to settling tank,inline will be a pressure valve so when you release the trigger the valve will divert the oil back into the settling tank,if you follow :) its cost just under £25 so worth doing i think
Ok, best I hold fire on the graphic until I get details of the dispenser. Have you thought of adding wheels and a draw bar? Then you could tow it on your collection round and call it a 4 in 1.
But no, hang on ... if you added a fryer and rented it to the pub you could have a 5 in 1, the possibilities are endless!
-
lol ;)
-
Mmm, chips with a hint of biodiesel, my favourite ;D
-
HA HA,blame RM for the dispensing set up idea,but make sure you dont take any electrical advice off him! as hes been trying to kill me for the last ten days apparently!
Julian its hardly any different as the graphics dont show the holding tank,anyway ive attacked my copy with ms paint and emailed it to you
-
earth wires pfft, who needs um ::)
should be earthed trhough pipes also... ?
the guy said not needed so "if thy right arm offends thee chop it off" gotto luv the bible.... the book of excuses
;D
-
Leccys helper drilled through a live cable before we found out that you had chopped off the house earth
Wants a little word with you :)
This care in the community is hard work
-
what happened then kieth they took ages to find what it was? and were drilling walls to find it?
-
Got the email and drawing, thanks.
Is holding tank the same as settling tank? (nearly got a whole battalion of tanks)
Would this arrangement be simpler http://www.biopowered.co.uk/w/images/5/59/KH_multi_tasking_processor_draft_3.png ?
Assume the dispensing system won't be re-circing for very long so over heating shouldn't be a problem. Also not re-circing back to the holding/settling tank won't stir up any settled crud.
Any thoughts on the live sight tube and height of Methoxide inlet?
Like your idea of showing the oil/bio route on the graphic. Might be an idea to show each of it's multifarious operations in this way.
-
what does V3 do? can this be used for shut off to site tube?
(http://img233.imageshack.us/img233/4355/khmulaskingprocessordra.png)
-
They're relief valves, squiggles = springs.
I think it's an ISO standard symbol or might have been BSI, cant remember, wherever it comes from I've used it for years.
To stopping the sight glass being live will require one more valve. V3 moves to the horizontal tank outlet and the new valve goes at the bottom of the sight tube. That way you can contra-operate the two valves and use the pump suction to empty the sight glass.
I asked the same question of Keith. V3 needs to be in that position so you can drain good oil off the top of the crud ... I thought you were chief engineer on this project!
"Spits on ground" ... just what I do whenever water washing is mentioned.
-
we bounce ideas off each other to see what pans out for best...
;D
-
Settling tank/ holding tank same thing sorry
Spits on ground :) is wvo oil in,bio out is via V5,BTW it can be dry wash tower,demething tank or water wash tank,i havnt said anything about w washing,we prefer to be exclusive not common!
Meth in-on the processors ive had its been soft piped to a carbouy gl vent,so position is not vital as long as its before the pump,in this case V2 is a 15mm valve,only becauce it was orig just a sample valve so on this particular one so not really suitable for oil in
Sight glass and press valves are good ideas,do you think it would be ok to show (Julians) ideas on the diagram and me to avoid showing close up photos of those particular bits?
Its a bit too late for me to implement them with out starting afresh,the drum would look like a collinder
Julian now has the dubious pleasure of helping to design something that isnt a GL,good on yer,seen the light at last ;D
-
yeah i been looking at the pic to see how to get over the site tube thing, but been busy on veg site with a certain link/thread...
will look at it again
K.H did you get me u2u on full pic?
-
flexy clear pipe is that the venturi feed in? and is it vavled as cant see by pic...
-
Oh dear ... I thought I had it sussed out.
I have the letters V5 a little a stray (it's still work in progress) V5 is intended to be "spits on the ground" valve at the bottom.
That said I don't see how "spits on the ground" can be oil in ... it's connected to the discharge of the pump. Or are you using a PTO on one of the tanks in the battalion to run a pump to pump it in?
Surely everything, including oil, must go in via V2, it's the only one connected to the pump suction.
This is where I'm at with the graphic. If you wish I'll remove the upstand after V2.
(http://www.biopowered.co.uk/w/images/4/4f/KH_multi_tasking_processor_draft_4.png)
With regard to helping those less fortunate than myself (the GLophobes) I'm only too happy to share the knowledge gained in build in building GL's.
I look at it a bit like 3rd world aid.
-
flexy clear pipe is that the venturi feed in? and is it vavled as cant see by pic...
No venturi,sucked in by v2
-
(http://img690.imageshack.us/img690/2641/800px3in1002.jpg)
-
flexy clear pipe is that the venturi feed in? and is it vavled as cant see by pic...
No venturi,sucked in by v2
sorry yes! no venturi but that clear pipe is to suck meth....
and is there a vlave at pipework end? else pipe would be left open?
-
Oh dear ... I thought I had it sussed out.
I have the letters V5 a little a stray (it's still work in progress) V5 is intended to be "spits on the ground" valve at the bottom.
That said I don't see how "spits on the ground" can be oil in ... it's connected to the discharge of the pump. Or are you using a PTO on one of the tanks in the battalion to run a pump to pump it in?
Surely everything, including oil, must go in via V2, it's the only one connected to the pump suction.
This is where I'm at with the graphic. If you wish I'll remove the upstand after V2.
(http://www.biopowered.co.uk/w/images/4/4f/KH_multi_tasking_processor_draft_4.png)
With regard to helping those less fortunate than myself (the GLophobes) I'm only too happy to share the knowledge gained in build in building GL's.
I look at it a bit like 3rd world aid.
V5 is teed down from V6 and is bio out there is a pipe and V8 missing,Julian have a look at my original sketch
-
The V8 shown above should be below the bottom pipe and is the wvo feed in and the V5 on the bend needs removing,Jesus this is confusing me :D,its pretty simple when your looking at the machine but in 2D its hard,i think my orig sketch is still ok but needs Julians site valve and pressure valve updates adding
All round to my place this weekend i reckon,i will supply the beer and you lot can disect the 3 in 1
-
yes im loosing it lo hahaha
what is confusing it is the feed in to tam is a T for good oil from one side and other side is bio bottom dome in reality so looking back and forth at pic and drawing is odd for me
???
-
the site tube i would plug the bottom of to seal and keep top fitting
at the bottom of the pipe put an elbow and pipe over to left to feed into pump (plenty room on horizontal pipe for valve too)
although this puts a valve on air vent/site tube then hmmm not good, so need to make a vent somewhere? and use site tube for site tube only.
-
Just another spanner in the works ... do you really need a sight tube if the drum's a clip top? Apart from Bio processing (when you wouldn't want to), you can just lift the lid and look inside.
-
Ive just compared the 2 and thats all i can spot thats wrong,if V8 and pipe is removed and put below the bottom pipe then that is the 2 feeds in to the pump and if V5 is taken off the bend and teed down from V6 it should make sense,i hope
RM,i will take your pics tomorrow
RM won the argument over having a site tube and its useful for stting the level,maybe optional :D
-
(http://img109.imageshack.us/img109/4355/khmulaskingprocessordra.png)
-
Ok ...
I put V5 where it is just to make the drawing look pretty. Technically it still does exactly the same job as the KH original sketch.
V8 was put where it is to save the need for the link pipe. Think we discussed it in an email.
Paul ...
What you've drawn is exactly what I drew.
Your V5 and my V5 connect to the pump discharge with no other valves in the way.
Your V8 and my V8 connect to the pump suction with no other valves in the way. You show pipes crossing which might get a little confusing for some people.
Schematically the drawings are identical.
-
i know julian they both same
trouble is we are all trying to get something that cant be got in a 2d drawing, i know you dont want cross over pipes, spiols look,
trying to match real thing and on a pic will get very messy and hard to read/understand so i think the easy way will be to go with yours, although pipes dont look like the real thing they are, its down to the builder to plumb where they want in theory it works, so all good...
-
Yes, I guess it's a bit like the tube map. It's nothing like the actual routes or distances, it's just a representation, but it's easy to follow.
Same applies to the relief valve for bio delivery. Both designs do the same thing your original just used more pipe work and had the settling/holding tank in the circuit.
Keith ...
Think I've got it now, but do you want settling tank called a settling tank or a holding tank? Your original sketches said settling.
-
Probably not going to be very popular for this, but I just had another look at the schematic and ...
Now you have introduced a second relief valve for fuel delivery and it now bypasses the pump, I have a suspicion that you don't need the original relief valve, which relieves back to the tank.
Again, releiving back to the tank might stir up the crud in the bottom.
-
I know we discussed it but it was making you think there was no way to suck the oil in with it,the above pic is close but the V8 pipe work needs to continue to the right and that connect to the bottom of the holding tank for oil in,the permanant pipe linking V1 to V8 which Julian suggested early on (ta Julian) needs a valve in the middle.
No oil comes in via the 15mm v2 and as this is the drawing for wvo lose the meth in description as it is used for samples (out) in wvo mode and will confuse things
Tossed a coin-holding tank
-
just woke up but try a new pic as you say K see what you think gis 5 mins...
being super moderator is very taxing... ::)
-
(http://img7.imageshack.us/img7/4355/khmulaskingprocessordra.png)
(http://img638.imageshack.us/img638/6307/unledkes.png)
-
Lose the word methoxide in wvo mode it is oil sample out,there is a valve on the link pipe going down from V1 to V8 (Julians link pipe)as this only comes into play on the bio side and V8 needs to be to the right of the down pipe which stops the holding tank flowing into the pump,clear as mud :D
-
Probably not going to be very popular for this, but I just had another look at the schematic and ...
Now you have introduced a second relief valve for fuel delivery and it now bypasses the pump, I have a suspicion that you don't need the original relief valve, which relieves back to the tank.
Again, releiving back to the tank might stir up the crud in the bottom.
Just got some more fittings and will test your idea tomorrow
-
for pumping out station it needs to release to the holding tank and not main tank, else it will emulsify
-
(http://img89.imageshack.us/img89/4355/khmulaskingprocessordra.png)
-
I'm plumbing it so it goes back in just before pump so it should loop when the nozzles shut
-
I'm plumbing it so it goes back in just before pump so it should loop when the nozzles shut
That's exactly what I meant. The only possible issue I can see is that if the system's left on re-circ. for a long period, it may heat up. If you are giving it a try it would be very interesting to see how long it takes to reach say, 10/20°C above ambient.
-
yeah dont suppose it would be on that long at all just to fill a car, i never fill mine to brim very much
but would be good to know if it does rise alot in temp?
-
OK all the alterations are now done and pics taken,the new valve doesnt affect the pressure at the top two filters to any great extent so the top valve remains but it does stop the strain on the pump with the dispensing nozzle closed as intended, with the bonus that it now keeps the bottom filter within the pressure limit.
As these valves cannot be totally closed the dispensing flow is not "full" on but plenty fast enough
Temp rises- i scrounged up 50 litres and circulated against the closed nozzle for a timed 5 minutes,starting temp 23.1 C ,end temp 30.9 C
Now to load up the pics :)
-
hmmm 7.8 in 5 mins is alot... but that is reciculating, getting volume hotter and hotter, going into car will pull through and no return temp to aid volume heating up...
its good it isnt full speed on the flow it may be way too much, so a reduction will be good when filling ya motor
im abit lost as to flow here? when in "dispensing mode" does any oil go back into first tank/processor? or does it all circulate into second holding tank?
-
what about the valve here?
ignore vlave underneath this writing its a TYPO lol
(http://img87.imageshack.us/img87/4355/khmulaskingprocessordra.png)
-
If you look at your piccy above,bottom left,it should go up,through bypass valve ,left,down into pump then up again,a sorta loop
-
Not that above,where did that come from?
-
it is a loop bigger one and V4 shut off
-
Not that above,where did that come from?
same as yours i just moved it over
-
Those last two posts have confused me,just look at the schematic with the bypass in the bottom left- it just loops in a small square without going near either tank
-
Give me 5 mins,i will try ms paint
-
yeah no worries kieth its excactly the same route but shows what pipes are used better in that loop for dispenser, i just used all the loop instead of that bottom corner, maybe better for people building to see whats going on with that part...
just a thought?
on that complex system now im lost ???
-
Ok solid red is dispensing route,dotted is what happens when you shut the nozzle,any clearer?
(http://i316.photobucket.com/albums/mm323/KRH01/khmulaskingprocessordra.png)
-
yup
same as me new drawing but i use the full rooute to aid cooling and visually to a newbie if the valve is over by second tank they see its for that part, but all same, and also its being filtered all the time till nozzle opens...
looking good though
so got all new pics K of full system?
also dont worry on U2U i sent you changed price already...
-
Doing pics now,plenty more if needed,havnt read any u2u,s not logged in
-
Altered existing pics,emailing you some others to see if you think they need using
-
AWESOME
that now looks professional and spot on, even rachael said it looks very nice and professional...
yup thats a peace of kit new pics are very good even got some bio in the site tube... and nice underneath shots and i think covered all angles now...
-
gotto shoot out back later chappers ;D
-
morning all fathers day peeps...
K.H i checked system pics, stick with what you have up there the best me thinks....
now heres one for you!
when the infamous bio rich man does that superb drawing thing he does best, why not like you did above with the red lines mark out 3x systems on the drawing aswell. get 3 pics of it the same and for veg filtering draw out the layout in blue, bio in red, pumping out in green, this is to show what pipes and part the system is used for each phase
;D
-
Good idea,i think Julian may have mentioned something along those lines anyway,mind you ive caused him enough aggro with just one ;D
-
No brain freeze, due to no brain!
This is the latest version incorporating all discussions to date (I hope).
I've reverted to an independent sight tube, but added a valve so it can be isolated during Bio making. Ability to empty tube was probably more trouble than it was worth.
Added V10 so V8 (22mm) can be used for oil suction.
Retained RV1 (shame the temperature rise was as quick as it was when RV2 is working) Only problem I can see is that when pumping out through V9, both RV's are live and one will lift before the other. If it's RV2 which lifts first, then the heating issue will still occur. Are they adjustable? If so RV2 needs to be set at a higher pressure than RV1.
(http://www.biopowered.co.uk/w/images/thumb/0/0c/KH_multi_tasking_processor_draft_5.png/542px-KH_multi_tasking_processor_draft_5.png)
-
Paul ... that schematic you refer to has got me confused. Are you creating an anti clockwise circuit via pump, V6 and V9 when dispensing nozzle is closed, and discharging to the car where it says "oil out to car" when it's open? If thats the case, then yes, I agree it would improve matters.
Lost me on the other points!
In the photo is that a 3 way valve at the bottom of the sight glass, Keith mentioned some about it but I didn't follow that either ... think I'm on an inactive brain week!
The main reason for reverting back to the way it was, was because to see the level via the tube, V3 needs to be open and cruddy oil will collect in quite a large length of pipe work. Personally I can't see the logic for a sight glass if you are pouring oil into an open topped tank ... you can see the level as you pour it in. Why would you then need to look at the side of the tank to check the level in the sight tube?
Bit like closing a door, seeing it's shut, then feeling the need to be on the other side to see if that's shut too!
-
no worries i was only seeing if we could do it another way
please ignore me ;D
-
No, won't ignore you, it's rude!
I could swap pipes withy V5 and V6 over do away with RV2, then take a pipe from the horizontal pipe to the left of V8, via RV2 round to the pipe between V6 and the filter.
Does that replicate what you were showing previously?
-
No brain freeze, due to no brain!
This is the latest version incorporating all discussions to date (I hope).
I've reverted to an independent sight tube, but added a valve so it can be isolated during Bio making. Ability to empty tube was probably more trouble than it was worth.
Added V10 so V8 (22mm) can be used for oil suction.
Retained RV1 (shame the temperature rise was as quick as it was when RV2 is working) Only problem I can see is that when pumping out through V9, both RV's are live and one will lift before the other. If it's RV2 which lifts first, then the heating issue will still occur. Are they adjustable? If so RV2 needs to be set at a higher pressure than RV1.
(http://www.biopowered.co.uk/w/images/thumb/0/0c/KH_multi_tasking_processor_draft_5.png/542px-KH_multi_tasking_processor_draft_5.png)
Yes they are adjustable the lower one is set high becauce it has the full power of the pump to open it,the top one you adjust as the filters block to keep the pressure at optimum
-
No, won't ignore you, it's rude!
I could swap pipes withy V5 and V6 over do away with RV2, then take a pipe from the horizontal pipe to the left of V8, via RV2 round to the pipe between V6 and the filter.
Does that replicate what you were showing previously?
Time to leave alone i think :D,Julians last schematic is a good copy of the system,spot on
Its now finished AFAIC,anymore alterations will take it away from the original idea of compactness and all three system have been tested and work,it is a compromise esp on the bio side,how far do i go?,i know every tee and 90 detract from the speed of bio making but?
The schematic has to reflect the actual system yes?
-
In the photo is that a 3 way valve at the bottom of the sight glass, Keith mentioned some about it but I didn't follow that either ... think I'm on an inactive brain week!
This is not for the schematic just explaining how it works
I always use one of these on top of my GL carbouy vent
(http://i316.photobucket.com/albums/mm323/KRH01/141.jpg)
(http://i316.photobucket.com/albums/mm323/KRH01/methatt002.jpg)
this attatches to the meth in pipe
On the actual sight tube i swapped the bottom 90 for a "ball fix" 90 ,so it can be isolated
then directly above that 90 i put one of these,same type but a tee
(http://i316.photobucket.com/albums/mm323/KRH01/140.jpg)
with me so far?
So when the level is set,isolate sight tube with the ball fix valve
Attatch meth in pipe (which as we know sucks)
Flick pump on for a few secs
oil is sucked out
Geddit?
-
GL carbouy vent ... Hmmm
I know this will cone as quite a shock, but not everybody uses GL designs.
The vents have always seemed over complicated to me and I've never used them.
Appreciate you taking the time to explain, but I'm still having trouble understanding the arrangement!
Does the schematic need any further changes to accommodate the arrangement I don't understand?
-
As said it was just for info,no changes needed ,,fine as is
Ok i will try again,basic version ;D ,i take the meth sucky pipe,in sucky mode and stick it in the sight tubey,and bobs your uncle sucks the oil out into tank
Not everybody uses the GL design? blasphemer!,stone him!,blessed are the cheesemakers
-
So it's not hard piped, you do it manually?
-
Yes,manually
-
Tony or Julian any chance of changing the page title? i was going with "3 in 1 processor" but Julian i see youve been labelling the diagrams "multi tasking" is that something you prefer? im happy with either
-
Happy to change it to whatever you want, it's your baby and your decision, just let me know.
You could go for the "KH processor" in a few years it'll become the GLophobes standard bit of kit. Fame will abound, praise will rain down on you from all corners of the globe and .... Hmm perhaps not!
Just uploaded three graphics, Can anyone reading give them a good look over for silly mistakes like open valves which should be closed, oil where it shouldn't be etc.
http://www.biopowered.co.uk/w/images/1/1c/KH_multi_tasking_processor_1.png
http://www.biopowered.co.uk/w/images/0/04/KH_multi_tasking_processor_2.png
http://www.biopowered.co.uk/w/images/2/25/KH_multi_tasking_processor_3.png
-
Happy to change it to whatever you want, it's your baby and your decision, just let me know.
You could go for the "KH processor" in a few years it'll become the GLophobes standard bit of kit. Fame will abound, praise will rain down on you from all corners of the globe and .... Hmm perhaps not!
Just uploaded three graphics, Can anyone reading give them a good look over for silly mistakes like open valves which should be closed, oil where it shouldn't be etc.
http://www.biopowered.co.uk/w/images/1/1c/KH_multi_tasking_processor_1.png
http://www.biopowered.co.uk/w/images/0/04/KH_multi_tasking_processor_2.png
http://www.biopowered.co.uk/w/images/2/25/KH_multi_tasking_processor_3.png
firstly brilliant job with drawings and good job on keeping your kool with us chucking stuff at you ???
from a quick look see, they all good to go, will take a deeper look later....
nice one chap 8)
-
KH processor? im not even tempted
But i am tempted to ask Tony for a wider range of smillies to annoy you with ;D
I like the ring of Multi tasking as 3 in 1 sort of gives the impression that it does all 3 equally whereas its heavily towards filtering
http://www.biopowered.co.uk/w/images/1/1c/KH_multi_tasking_processor_1.png
Could you open V3 pls
http://www.biopowered.co.uk/w/images/0/04/KH_multi_tasking_processor_2.png
http://www.biopowered.co.uk/w/images/2/25/KH_multi_tasking_processor_3.png
Both fine,nice one thanks again Julian
-
Happy to change it to whatever you want, it's your baby and your decision, just let me know.
You could go for the "KH processor" in a few years it'll become the GLophobes standard bit of kit. Fame will abound, praise will rain down on you from all corners of the globe and .... Hmm perhaps not!
Just uploaded three graphics, Can anyone reading give them a good look over for silly mistakes like open valves which should be closed, oil where it shouldn't be etc.
http://www.biopowered.co.uk/w/images/1/1c/KH_multi_tasking_processor_1.png
http://www.biopowered.co.uk/w/images/0/04/KH_multi_tasking_processor_2.png
http://www.biopowered.co.uk/w/images/2/25/KH_multi_tasking_processor_3.png
firstly brilliant job with drawings and good job on keeping your kool with us chucking stuff at you ???
from a quick look see, they all good to go, will take a deeper look later....
nice one chap 8)
I spotted one last night after I posted.
In pic 2 the sight tube valve is closed when it should be open. Let me know any other up cocks and I'll make all the alterations at the same time.
-
KH processor? im not even tempted
But i am tempted to ask Tony for a wider range of smillies to annoy you with ;D
I like the ring of Multi tasking as 3 in 1 sort of gives the impression that it does all 3 equally whereas its heavily towards filtering
http://www.biopowered.co.uk/w/images/1/1c/KH_multi_tasking_processor_1.png
Could you open V3 pls
http://www.biopowered.co.uk/w/images/0/04/KH_multi_tasking_processor_2.png
http://www.biopowered.co.uk/w/images/2/25/KH_multi_tasking_processor_3.png
Both fine,nice one thanks again Julian
You don't really mean that do you? What I think you mean is ... with which to annoy you.
KH processor ... you know you want to. I think we should start our first poll on the wiki forum!
Pic 1 shows the KH processor in Biodiesel mode. In that mode surely you want to draw from the very bottom of the processor .. or does a KH work on different principals?
-
To be honest the only time i use the sight valve is to set the level for bio making,then i drain it and it remains closed,well in the two batches so far anyway
Opps a reply while i was typing
Anymore of that and i will use text/chav speak and smillies!
Ok V3,i dont think we need to show this but what i have to do is open V3 and shut V1 for a 5/10 min period to create the suction to get the meth in via V2,in otherwords leave it as it is
-
wouldnt pulling from both valves not just bottom aid "agitation" mixing better? ::)
:) ;) :D ;D >:( :( :o 8) ??? ::) :P :-[ :-X :-\ :-* :'(
-
Ah, good thinking won't that sort of fiddling with valves be clear from the state diagram, showing the valve positions for each of the operations.
I'll try and have a crack at those over the next few days. They are pure wiki or html code, so I'll probably dump them direct on the page if that's OK with you. Can I use your original sketches for those or have things changed?
Still unsure of the sight glass requirement, but my thinking was to show it open for all WVO modes and closed for Bio except when loading the feed stock.
PS what's a Chav?
-
wouldnt pulling from both valves not just bottom aid "agitation" mixing better? ::)
:) ;) :D ;D >:( :( :o 8) ??? ::) :P :-[ :-X :-\ :-* :'(
I don't think so. My guess would be that the one with least resistance would take preference over the other. Again a guess, but with the glycerol settling in the tank it's density would probably favour the V10 route.
And less of the bloody smilies!
-
Just starting the State diagram for the KH Processor in WVO treatment mode, so the first of many questions ...
To what temperature does the oil need to be heated?
What is the minimum settling period before dry oil can be tapped off?
Should the dry oil be tapped off before draining the crud or should you drain the crud first?
-
Just noticed another issue with the drawings ... none of the graphics show the pressure gauges.
-
Just noticed another issue with the drawings ... none of the graphics show the pressure gauges.
(http://img193.imageshack.us/img193/430/smilies.gif)
-
Just starting the State diagram for the KH Processor in WVO treatment mode, so the first of many questions ...
To what temperature does the oil need to be heated? 60c
What is the minimum settling period before dry oil can be tapped off? i go 1 week (after a 1 week settle time befoe that)
Should the dry oil be tapped off before draining the crud or should you drain the crud first? can be either (you will know how much you tip in thats pants...)
-
Pls check out the page for state of play.
-
can you drop the WVO pic in by it to see valve set open/closed to reference each other please...
-
There you go ...
-
Are we doing a 7% water prewash with the KH Processor?
-
Ok, all graphics and state diagrams for the KH Processor are loaded to the page, await comments and revisions.
I think some of the notes in the state diagrams could be included in the step by step text, yet to be written.
-
Nice :)
Is heating to 60C and settling adequate for the really wet creamy oils?
Particularly interested in this as I have some very creamy oil to process at the moment (well, the oil that isn't currently all over the shed floor at the moment :P )
-
hmmm i see what you mean, before my oil goes in the heat tank its already been through a sheet in a separate tank and settled for a week, then tipped through another sheet on the heat tank.
creamy / fatty stuff i tend to pass on, but the sheet grabs a big percentage of fats. so 60 is prolly still ok.
this all for veg running, if for bio i spose can be worked a different way, cooked higher and evaporated off.
-
WVO mode = V11 closed (empty site tube) on heating/settling oil part.
oil in/pump to settling tank = open
Pump to settling tank "notes" could add (oil passes through V9 but if filters block it passes through release valve back into tank)
==============
bio grid looks unfinished ?
-
The graphic is wrong, I should have shown the valve open, but I don't see how there's any way to empty the sight tube unless the tank is empty.
Keith said the oil was poured in through the sieve. Are you saying it's pumped in? Or have I got the wrong end of the stick again?
I agree that could be stated, but to keep things consistent with the other processor pages, this one could do with a step by step text, if KH agrees. The notes in the state diagram were only really intended to be very brief. Hence my comment somewhere above.
How do you mean unfinished? If you mean the dotted boxes, I didn't notice those last night ... I've just got a space in the wrong place somewhere which I'll try and sort out later.
-
re: sitetube
yes i see what you mean i think in reality it can be drained as mine is, as the real one k.h has can do this i think, but the pic as shown cant, so yeah see what you mean...
i empty the tube for cooking else liltte or no heat gets in there so will be unsettled/uncooked oil
-
Just starting the State diagram for the KH Processor in WVO treatment mode, so the first of many questions ...
To what temperature does the oil need to be heated?
What is the minimum settling period before dry oil can be tapped off?
Should the dry oil be tapped off before draining the crud or should you drain the crud first?
Temps set as 65C for both
-
Just noticed another issue with the drawings ... none of the graphics show the pressure gauges.
Not a problem AFAIC,shown clearly in the pics so should be obvious
-
Are we doing a 7% water prewash with the KH Processor?
Yes,i always find it worthwhile
-
The graphic is wrong, I should have shown the valve open, but I don't see how there's any way to empty the sight tube unless the tank is empty.
Keith said the oil was poured in through the sieve. Are you saying it's pumped in? Or have I got the wrong end of the stick again?
I agree that could be stated, but to keep things consistent with the other processor pages, this one could do with a step by step text, if KH agrees. The notes in the state diagram were only really intended to be very brief. Hence my comment somewhere above.
How do you mean unfinished? If you mean the dotted boxes, I didn't notice those last night ... I've just got a space in the wrong place somewhere which I'll try and sort out later.
Oil in through drum filter
-
re: sitetube
yes i see what you mean i think in reality it can be drained as mine is, as the real one k.h has can do this i think, but the pic as shown cant, so yeah see what you mean...
i empty the tube for cooking else liltte or no heat gets in there so will be unsettled/uncooked oil
As RM says i can actually drain the real one,but is a bit of cross contamination that bad?
On my main processor i never drain down totally between batches,i only worry about the washed and dried fuel,first few litres get bunged back into the tanks along with 50/50,s and 27/3 samples, ;D
-
Ok ... the next round of changes. Taking replies in order ...
I'll show the sight tube valve open in the graphic, just as it would be when filling (still beats me why one is needed when you can see in the top of the tank, but then I don't have a processor named after me!)
As there's no facility to drain the sight tube on the schematic, shall I leave it full of oil for the duration of the process or would you like me to modify the graphic to show a means of draining?
I'll change the temperatures to 65°C
I think it will be fun drawing the pressure gauges, so I'm happy to show them ... the gauge graphic can always be reused again in the future (unless there are strong opinions against)
I already included the water wash ... I too think it's a great process.
Oil in is described as through the filter, so no change there.
If these are the final comments on the sight tube, ignore the second item above and I'll leave as is.
So, any other changes required .. speak now or for ever ... etc etc.
Keith are you going to do text to accompany each processing stage similar to the other processors?
And have we finally settled on "The KH multi-tosser, sorry tasker" as a title?
Off to the pub quiz now, pick up your replies later.
-
Tosser bit im used to but if you dont drop the KH bit your in trouble!
Yes i will add the text when i can,im happy with the site tube as you described
Are you going to the BBB Julian?
-
Re: site tube
when you have a full cruddy fatty 400 micron barrel strainer or a bed sheet clamped, you aint seeing nothing from the top chap :o
need that tube daddio ;)
(http://img183.imageshack.us/img183/1411/2009019ta0.jpg)
-
M.T processor sort of has a nice ring to it! 8)
liked 3 in 1 reminds me of the good ol days when i was a kid and id use me grandads 3in1 oil on the bikes i used to make up as couldnt afford a new one... :)
-
I,ll get my violin :)
-
:-[
-
On yer bike! ;D
Oooh sorry, insensitive ;)
-
Tosser bit im used to but if you dont drop the KH bit your in trouble!
Yes i will add the text when i can,im happy with the site tube as you described
Are you going to the BBB Julian?
I was going to attend on the Saturday but I'm a little reluctant now if I'm in "trouble".
Re: site tube
when you have a full cruddy fatty 400 micron barrel strainer or a bed sheet clamped, you aint seeing nothing from the top chap
need that tube daddio
Fair point, now I see the logic, thanks.
M.T processor sort of has a nice ring to it!
liked 3 in 1 reminds me of the good ol days when i was a kid and id use me grandads 3in1 oil on the bikes i used to make up as couldnt afford a new one...
Keith's choice, but not many people would pass up the chance to be immortalised within the bio-sphere.
I'll try and make the changes this week.
-
All done.
I noticed another valve in the wrong orientation and changed that too.
-
im always getting me valves wrong... :)